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I've been reading a tome on the natural history of California. I just finished reading a portion about the laws of thermodynamics. It's the second law of thermodynamics that's blowing me away.

Energy can be converted from one form to another, but transformations are never completely efficient.

Disorder (entropy) tends to occur during energy transformations; therefore to create order or put things in a precise arrangement, requires more energy than can be reclaimed later.

I'm thinking this law must also apply to spiritual matters. Like God can pour his grace into us all the live-long day, but we can only convert 1% of this grace into anything fruitful.

Perhaps this explains why, after years of spiritual struggle, all that came from me was a pea-sized grape that quickly withered and fell to the ground where ants fed upon it until they were drunk with joy. A handful of drunk ants. This is my spiritual contribution to the universe. Christ was crucified for a handful of drunk ants.

Fuck. Hopefully I can use the law of thermodynamics as a justifiable excuse on Judgment Day.

I'm at least going to use it as an excuse to not clean the house today.

Forgive me.
(deleted comment)

Date: 2006-02-06 10:36 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] createdestiny.livejournal.com
Hoots. That's another one of my contributions to the universe. Thanks for reminding me.

Date: 2006-02-07 12:14 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] reney427.livejournal.com
mind if i borrow your excuse? sweet. thanks.

Date: 2006-02-07 12:15 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] createdestiny.livejournal.com
It's not an excuse. It's the LAW! ;)

Date: 2006-02-07 01:45 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] whosplittheatom.livejournal.com
haha, what's up with both of us obsessing about thermodynamics lately?! craziness!

You would really like this book I've been reading, on chaos theory. Chaos, mathematically, is basically another name for the behavior of what they call "nonlinear dynamic systems", for example, things like the weather, the motion of water, population growth patterns of various species, fluctuations of the stock market, the thermal convection inside an oven or in a pot of water on the stove, etc. Basically, there is a sort of reverse principle to entropy in which systems that are far from thermodynamic equilibrium (ie. systems with low entropy) basically order themselves around these mathematical patterns called attractors. The whirlpools of water that you see in a running stream, for example, are attractors. Our solar system is such a nonlinear (ie. chaotic) system, and interestingly, the earth is in this really ideal yet very narrow range for biological life to exist and flourish, and so much of the action and motion we see here, both in the natural world and in human society, exists at this very fascinating place at the very edge of chaos. It's ordered enough to where we can find patterns everywhere, but close enough to chaos that there's no way we can predict much of anything in the long term simply because there are far too many variables involved, and chaotic systems are both feedback-dependent and extremely sensitive to initial conditions (for example, imagine what a different timeline your life would have evolved along had I not randomly decided to pick up a newspaper to look in the classifieds that one day in summer 1993, and happened to see the ad for the parking garage!)

Anyway, ramble ramble...

I haven't figured out which natural Law would be best to use as a justifiable excuse on Judgement day, haha. If nothing else, I'll just say "I plead the Zodiac!!" ;)

Date: 2006-02-07 02:54 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] createdestiny.livejournal.com
My mind really wants to resist going too deeply into the awareness of choas in the universe because, well, the whole idea of God's Providence. It's just...too....freakin'...huge and paradoxical...brain...will...explode.

Date: 2006-02-07 01:57 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] whosplittheatom.livejournal.com
hehe, I totally know what you mean...

As you've probably known for a long time, my ideas and thoughts about God aren't exactly the most Orthodox or even Christian. Even when I tried to tow the line, it was only a temporary thing. I range from being somewhat atheist in some ways, to being very agnostic much of the time, and when I do believe or have a sense of God, it's very much in the sense of scientific pantheism. At the very least, God seems to be an extremely subjective entity, whose nature and actions seem vry dependent on things like a) each individual's own percption and maturity level, b) culture, environment, and circumstance, and c) the degree and manner to which the individual engages God. To say that there is a "true God", objective and above all this, is both a tautology and a red herring - even the highest of mystics cannot escape their own subjectivity, on the contrary they probably moreso than most are far more deeply immersed in it!

I guess what I'm saying is, the religious term "God's Providence" is, for me, completely interchangable with the scintific term "chaotic determinism". Whether we call the determining factor "God" or "the Cosmos" seems to be a moot point, simply because there's more than enough magic and mystery and wonder and crazy synchronicity in the natural world alone, without needing to invoke any supernatural agent in attempt to explain it.

This is actually a very good realization for me personally, because it keeps my feet on the ground and my head from going too far into the clouds - and we all know what a problem I've had with that in the past! And I've noticed, for example, that the exact same mental processes are at work in me when I contemplate the world from a naturalistic perspective, as when I pray from a supernaturalistic perspective - the essence is the same, only the terminology is transposed.

But yeah, you've seen Darren Aronofsky's 'Pi', right? There's definitely something to be said for knowing when your brain is far enough in. "Seek God, but do not inquire as to the nature of His dwelling-place..." Yup, I can testify to that from firsthand experience!

Date: 2006-02-07 02:07 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] posteverything.livejournal.com
Ha, well played.

Date: 2006-02-07 02:50 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] nameleswanderer.livejournal.com
So that explains why my mind is so messy.

Date: 2006-02-07 02:55 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] createdestiny.livejournal.com
Yeppers. It also explains why my hair gets frizzy.

Date: 2006-02-07 06:44 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] nameleswanderer.livejournal.com
No, I think that is because you keep sticking the coat hanger in the light socket.

There are drunk cockroaches too

Date: 2006-02-07 05:18 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sardonic-artery.livejournal.com
I don't think God has mismanaged poorly here. I just think more happens than we get to see.

Re: There are drunk cockroaches too

Date: 2006-02-07 12:17 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] createdestiny.livejournal.com
No, I'm not implying that God has mismanaged anything.

But, the law of thermodynamics is responsible for the fact that only 1% of the solar energy that falls on a green plant is converted to food and only 10% of that energy is incorporated into the animal that eats it. There is a lot of energy lost in this conversion. Not God's "fault" but perhaps a result of "the fall."

And if this happens in the natural world, perhaps it also happens in the spiritual world--God's grace being his uncreated energies and us being leaky vessels of that grace.

Re: There are drunk cockroaches too

Date: 2006-02-07 12:19 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] createdestiny.livejournal.com
P.S. But, yeah, there's a lot more going on than meets the eye. Hopefully something great and soul-saving is brewing.

Date: 2006-02-07 07:21 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] andeepants.livejournal.com
I relate more to Newton's Third Law: "For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction."

If I approach a female at a certain velocity, she repels at that same velocity. To safe face, I hack it up to the laws of physics; though it probably has more to do with nature's cruel play: natural selection.

Date: 2006-02-07 12:25 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] createdestiny.livejournal.com
Funny.

Newton's Third Law makes me want to go back to bed. Why should I go to work today if Newton's third law dicates that if I go to work today my car will require an expensive repair, the cost of which is equal to the money I will earn by going to work today?

Date: 2006-02-07 08:11 am (UTC)
gracegiver: (Default)
From: [personal profile] gracegiver
OH CRAP!!

I have another friend on my list who goes by creactivity, and I got your names mixed up. what's so amazing is you guys think so much alike, I really thought this was her!!! I came inches from responding as if this were her post, but then realized I didn't know one person on your list of commentors.

1% of His grace is a lot, yanno.

Date: 2006-02-07 05:57 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] andeepants.livejournal.com
I dunno, all an all, laws of thermodynamics are hard to compare to vague concepts like "god's grace." I find god to be an ad-hoc hypothesis; where different concepts are brought about to explain away the holes in other concepts. But you know that I am a staunch atheist and find nothing consoling or great about the postulation of god to begin with, so I am never on the hunt to find a way that he may exist and not be accountable for the disorderly nature of the world.

House cleaning

Date: 2006-02-13 06:30 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] raingirl26.livejournal.com
I'm spiritual, but not religious, which brings me to focus more on excuses to not clean the house. I tend to not need excuses - I just don't clean. When I moved in with my now husband I stated out loud that I didn't vacuum. That pretty much still holds today, 21 years later. It feels like dirty houses get in the way of me doing my real life's work, but when they get clean, I still lack focus to get my stuff done. Where do I find the energy to go in the right direction?

Re: House cleaning

Date: 2006-02-16 03:11 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] createdestiny.livejournal.com
I don't know what the question is, but Green Tea is the answer. ;)

Date: 2006-02-14 04:28 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] lcurtis.livejournal.com
The laws of thermodynamics are beyond my understanding I have just sorta figured out Newtons universe. Actually there is some rather heavy stuff running through this post and the responses thereto. To some of you seekers I might recommend a relatively new book by a Ursala Goodenough, "The Sacred Depth of Nature". Some answers there and of course more questions.

Date: 2006-02-15 12:02 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] createdestiny.livejournal.com
Okay, thanks.

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